Skill

[Eric]

Hello everyone,

After watching some of the debates online, especially over at KFO, its seems as though a lot of people are talking past each other on matters of "skill." I was hoping to check if what I see as "skill" for my own kung fu training is what it should be.

I look at skill and see it comprised of two things:

1. Attribute - This is what is built in a fixed-time or fixed-space environment, a characteristic or reaction that is built for a specific purpose. For example, if an incoming punch turns round, use a biu sao, or if someone collapses my bridge in a specific way, use a tan sao. Very much 'Technique thinking' oriented

2. Concept - This is what is built through a focus point during the exercise. For example continuous forward energy, which can be illustrated through, defense against long kicks (moving in, distoring range), chi sao, or a myriad of other drills.

I see "skill" as the marriage of these two things in a live and adaptive environment. What do you guys think?

[Louie]

\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English skil, from Old Norse, distinction, knowledge; probably akin to Old English scylian to separate, sciell shell -- more at SHELL

1 obsolete : CAUSE, REASON

2 a : the ability to use one's knowledge effectively and readily in execution or performance b : dexterity or coordination especially in the execution of learned physical tasks

3 : a learned power of doing something competently : a developed aptitude or ability <language skills>


I can see what your getting at but I believe

that an attribute is something that can be owned.

A concept is something that is believed or followed.

Skill is a category all its own.
You dont really need both to build a skill
you do need atleast one.

Ex. Painter who has great artistic attributes, but no sense of color concept or theory can posses great skill.

Ex 2. An engineer who has great concept of Physics and flight can skillfully build an extrodinary Flying machine without the attributes of a pilot.

I believe having both can enable you to have greater skill if you can find balance within the two. but skill can come from a single parent.

[Eric]

Louie,

Thanks for the input, wasn't sure what answer I'd get out of this question. I'm going to have to disagree with your first argument that skill can have only one parent, this is what I'm seeing:

A person who has the attribute of how to use a brush but never studied concepts is a PAINTER

A person who know color theory, depth cues etc, but has never put brush to canvas is a THEORETICIAN (or art critic)

A person who knows color theory and has the ability to control the tool is an ARTIST.

A PAINTER can paint my house, but not the mona lisa
A THEORETICIAN can communicate about art, but not make it
An ARTIST can make art a form of communication.

So, trying to relate it back to kung fu:

Someone with an attribute can do a drill.
Someone with a concept can explain a drill.
Someone with both can use what was gained from the drill in any setting.

This is just what I've been thinking; is it important to deliniate between these?

[Louie]

I Can repect your views but still have to add 2 more cents.

being a professional artist myself I can say

A person who has the attribute of how to use a brush but never studied concepts is an Artist or illustrator

A person who know color theory, depth cues etc, but has never put brush to canvas is more of a graphic artist or Art Director

A person who knows color theory and has the ability to control the tool is more of a fine artist.

An artist can paint my portrait as well as amural on my house
An Art Director can communicate about art, and delegate the production
A Fine ARTIST can make Legendery art.

So, myself relating it back to kung fu:

Someone with an attribute can Fight.
Someone with a concept can teach to Fight.
Someone with both can be and teach great fighters.

Skill can be very specific or very broad.
but thats neither here nor there we use and believe what works for our own.
so keep up the skill training my opinion is just that, my own.
If you choose to agree or not no big deal Im man enough to take it . ha ha

Talk to you later

[Ben@HFY]

Eric & Louie-

When I read your posts, instantly one of GM Gee magnificent one-liner was in my mind.

Although it does not define what 'skill' (in the context of kung fu) is, it tells all when you've reached the point the you have those skills

"Mind understands, body knows"

rgds

Ben