Correction to Wing Chun Unity Article - Kung Fu Tai Chi Magazine --Marty Goldberg

[Op108wc]

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?p=657436#post657436

[Savi]

You know, after reading the article and then reading that post over on KFO... it is quite clear that unity cannot live long in the face of ego.

The article seemed to me to acknowledge those that were involved with the "2004 Wing Chun Gathering", citing past events relevant to the groups in attendance.

If people want to gripe about it because they weren't involved in the gathering, what gives them a place to say anything? Where was Marty at the gathering? Where was Rene?

Instead of crying about it, write your own article! How about writing an article to acknowledge ALL "unity" events in the WC community over the past 20 years around the globe so nobody gets bent out of shape?

Come on!

[Cang Long]

Savi,
Arguing over unity is a pretty silly thing but the way Marty went about it is even more peculiar seeing that he claims to be a unifier and not a divider. This is just another reminder no matter what you do and for what purpose or cause you do it stay focused and aware that people will be gunning for you with legitimate reasons or not.

[Op108wc]

Cang Long,

Ditto that.

How will the audience understand someone "Marty" who does not connect any definite idea with what he is talking about?


El




Marty,

You failed to say what exactly needs to be corrected. Are you suggesting you have a copywrite of the term "friendship seminar" or "Wing Chun Gathering" nothing you have stated in your original post points to anything specifically you would ask Gene to "Correct". Your post submits that you are upset that the Ving Tsun Museum might try to portray themselves as an organization that is also out in the WC community promoting unity but maybe yourself and Rene came up with some idea of "unity" or "friendship" or "gathering" first. In fact those are not new ideas that you have a patten on and in fact the museum was doing that very thing on May 2-4 in 1997 before "your" firts "gathering".

http://home.vtmuseum.org/timeline/1997.php

Quote:
Benny, (representing the VTM I assume) was present at the seminar as an attendee.
So, now your not even sure if Master Meng was even representing the VTM but you are against misleading the public, right
Quote:
Also on Saturday was a friendship exchange where everyone talked and Chi Sau’d together. Sifu Meng provided everyone with a new perspective about Moy Yat Ving Tsun with his knowledge and skill that he displayed. In fact they were impressed enough that he was invited to speak on Sunday about the Moy Yat family Ving Tsun and Chi Sau. Sifu Meng also talked about the Ving Tsun Museum and it’s future. There appeared to be much support for this by the people in attendance. Afterwards everyone wrapped things up and said their goodbyes.
Maybe that will refresh your memory.
http://home.vtmuseum.org/timeline/19...16-17_1998.php

Maybe you prefer to review this -

Quote:
The first Friendship Seminar, held in Victoria, B.C., from May 21-23, started off on Friday night and Marty Goldberg set the tone with his painfully classic line: "I just flew in from Wisconsin, and boy are my bong sao tired!" When the groaning died-down, we mingled for a short while and got to know each other. A special treat was finally meeting face-to-face with people like Dan Lucas (webmaster of Wing Chun World), whom we've known via the internet for a long time and Benny Meng from the Ving Tsun Museum. Following this, Ray Van Raamsdonk gave a rundown of how the seminar would work, with each presenter doing 2-hour blocks on both Saturday and Sunday, with time for short breaks in between and free, friendly play at the end.
http://www.hanweionline.org/wingchun/1998_victoria.php

Quote:
originally posted by pvwingchun
We included Sifu Meng and sought out his input because of his group of students being there as an integral part of the gathering also knowing full well of his ties and ability to get things published which we knew could help us to get out the information. As such Sifu Meng included and added a few paragraphs to preface the article which gave background and history on previous gatherings.
History on previous gatherings attended by the VTM means not limited to your specific "gathering" because they participate in so many "gatherings".

Quote:
Originally posted by martyg.
How about this then, would you consider running a short article on these original 4 Friendship Seminars if one were put together?
Why didn't you just ask that in the first place.
__________________
Tony Jacobs

[Cang Long]

Hello El,
How will the audience understand someone "Marty" who does not connect any definite idea with what he is talking about? True the message is unclear because the intent is unclear. From the outside looking in when there is a need for clarity of purpose it is best to look toward action and not words to find understanding. Resentment and frustration clearly are not motivating factors for true warriors.

[Op108wc]

Well, Where was Marty? I wouldn’t know….
Where was Rene?
I would give a guess. Probably Rene was very busy sending his private e-mails to his friends, telling them not to go anywhere near Master Meng, nor the gathering.


If people want to gripe about it because they weren't involved in the gathering, what gives them a place to say anything? Where was Marty at the gathering? Where was Rene?

Well, I am aware that in the past, a certain Master of a certain Shaolin system wished to visit the VTM. On hearing this, Rene, Robert and Hendrik sent secretive, private e-mails to this Master, telling him not to go anywhere near Master Meng, nor the museum. Why would they do this? This is purely childish, unprofessional, biased and unacceptable behaviour.





Nothing is more valuable than a friendship exchange and nothing is cost more nowadays than a gathering.


True the message is unclear because the intent is unclear. From the outside looking in when there is a need for clarity of purpose it is best to look toward action and not words to find understanding. Resentment and frustration clearly are not motivating factors for true warriors.

[Op108wc]

There is no higher religion than human service. To work for the common good is the greatest creed. – Albert Schweitzer


John Sterling, Thank you for the article.

None of us are perfect. There is no one who cannot teach somebody something, and there is no one so excellent that he cannot be excelled.




I have had enough of reading this for the past few days.

Marty this is not in any way meant to take away from you or what you are trying to do, or attacking what you are looking at doing or have said about past gatherings, but I must speak my mind now. Please go forward with your recollection of the events that happened in the past. I understand where you are coming from. Good luck and I am hoping others don't attack you like they have this article. I am sure there are many out there who would like to read about the gatherings that you were involved in and put together. Although somewhere I am sure someone will take issue with it. So a word of advice make it bland and don't put in any names or facts and for that matter don't use your name as the author.

Neither the VTM nor Sifu Meng wrote the article I did so stop attacking the VTM and Sifu Meng, attack me, I was the primary author, I wrote the article. Sifu Meng's input was sought out because his students were there first and second of all because we knew he could help to get it published. The authors are listed in the fashion they are because I opted to do it that way to show respect to those involved who have practiced longer than I have. Everyone listed had input and suggested or made minor changes, but I am responsible for the bulk of the article. I am sorry if I have gotten one or two facts wrong, although I am not sure they are it is simply a matter of semantics and viewpoints. Again as stated in an earlier post I wasn't around then so I don't know the players or the particulars.

Everyone seems to be upset about one sentence, maybe two in the article (IMO), at least as per my copy the VTM is mentioned only twice, I have not seen the article in print and at this point do not care to. As a whole this shows the pettiness of many of you here and your desire to tear down anything that is not of your making or doing. I beleive that just the mention of the VTM is the whole problem. Read into those few sentences what you will but semantics are the root of the problem. For that matter if one word in one sentence gets changed then no one has a problem (change "led" to "has been involved with"). Except that those of you with the problem will read into it what you want anyway. Peoples perceptions vary on these events and one persons being involved is another persons lack of involvement and anothers leading the way. I for one do not feel like I was heavily involved in the event but others may view it differently.

This article was written to say, " look at what we are trying to do in Arizona", and to give credit to Sifu Grose for his work. Although I am not associated with the VTM or HFY it seems to me that no matter what is written by them is attacked. Again stop attacking them and attack me. This is ridiculous. This article is about Sifu Grose and what he has accomplished in Arizona or is at least trying to. Instead of wringing hands and gnashing teeth why not show up and participate then write your own article.

Ths is also the talk of other forums and lists. I can't beleive how people over there are even tearing down what happened. Guess what if you don't show up you don't get a say in what happens. Instead of complaining, come and visit, hang out, be friendly and make a difference.

I am sure there are those of you out there whose hair I have set on fire. Oh well. I am sure you will write what you want go ahead but I will not repsond to any attacks, accusations, comments, questions, etc., except to say this. The next time Sifu Grose has a get together in Arizona instead of complaining about it or what is written show up and make a difference. Especially those of you in Arizona.

Also I hope that I have not offended any of my fellow authors who I have the greatest respect for I am sorry if I have but this needed to be said.

John Sterling
__________________
Wing Chun Kuen Alliance
www.wing-chun.us