Wing Chun Vs Karate

[Op108wc]

Wing Chun Vs Karate

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpRNReo8KkE&search=praying%20mantis%20kung%20fu%20wing%20tsun% 20chun

[DubChenBadanger]

Glad you brought this one up.
You can tell that the kid doing Wing Chun is a green horn (probably 1st student level) and a bit on the nerdy side too (wimp). This was obviously staged to bash Wing Chun.
Bring your Karate best to my gym or any reputable gym and watch how fast we beat the ugly out of you. Better yet we'll start coming to you with cameras and start closing your gyms down.
The day any Karate man can beat any equal experience (months) Wing Tsun woman will be the day I quit the style.
DB

[RAB]

I don't think it is fair to call the wing chun guy a wimp. He went into the ring with what he had. And I'm sure he never planned on being carried out.

Also, we don't if he enroll himself without the approval of his coach or if his trainer encourage him enter the tourament.

From what I watched, it look like the rules were no contact on the face or below the belt.

What do you think he could have done based on these limitations?

[DubChenBadanger]

This is the problem with entering tournaments. Most are held to profile a given school so you fight by their rules or to their advantage to say the least.
This kid was an idiot not just a wimp. He has singlehandedly embarrassed several Wing Chun lineages with his weak display.
Like I have already said, this appears to be a phoney clip. There is too much wrong with it. Do you think this Gump through this together to celebrate his ***-whoppin or did the Karatchi guys catch him before the show doing form by the tracks? The story just doesn't add up!
As far as fighting in a tournament with those rules, the side of the neck is my favorite target, then the collar bone, arms, legs, torso, (usually in that order).
If the kid was worth his salt the only thing he would have to do is punch on the center line when ever his opponent came into range. If he knew some footwork he could have stayed inside...
Everything he did was wrong! How can you defend that?

[RAB]

Sports have rules and for those that want to play, they must follow the rules. Wing Chun is not an all-purpose, it has purpose. If you in a fire fight you run out of ammo, don't use wing chun technques. Take cover.


That's odd that you think he represents lineages or wing chun in general or that you think it's a phooney clip. Do you believe that you represent lineages or wing chun in general?

Lastly, it sounds like you would have been carried out as well. Half of what you said you would have done, you can't do in that ring. He got hurst because he couldn't applied a defense such as smoothering his attacks or attack at an angle. When you are facing a stronger opponent, don't face him in the inside, take the outside gates and press.

Anyway, I'm glad you have the fighting spirit to say something, because that say you would done something. I'm surprised so few people talk around here.

[DubChenBadanger]

It is obvious you don't know the first thing about Wing Tsun or even how to fight. I have had over a hundred fights in and out of the ring and have never been carried out punk! I took Karatchi (TKD) for several years and it is well known that a boxer/grappler can tear them up by getting in close. I experienced that in street fights several times. I was 27 when I found Wing Tsun and had 17 years of martial arts experience at that time (previous training in several Shaolin forms and Karate). I figured like everyone says that "There ain't no ultimate martial art!" Even though I had experience in several schools of thought and was comfortable with what I knew, I threw it all away to learn Wing Tsun because I had always heard the BS about a weaker opponent defeating a strong one with technique. Wing Tsun is the only system I have experienced that can actually claim that statement. It is the ultimate martial art as far as my experience (38 years now) has shown me. The science behind the technique is geared toward defence in a life or death situation. It is perfect in every way. There is nothing sporting about Wing Tsun. Sports martial arts play fight. That kind of training will get you hurt (or killed) on the street!
If you think that video is not fake I got a bridge to sell you Forest:rol:
You can't be that stupid!
DB

[RAB]

That was a mouth full. I’m glad that this forum finally has a verbal debate about something!

“I have had over a hundred fights in and out of the ring and have never been carried out punk!”

Most people don’t realize that they had to be carried out until much later.

“I took Karatchi (TKD) for several years and it is well known that a boxer/grappler can tear them up by getting in close. I experienced that in street fights several times.”

Are you saying that after getting beat up several times, you gave up TKD and tried wing tsun?

“I was 27 when I found Wing Tsun and had 17 years of martial arts experience at that time (previous training in several Shaolin forms and Karate).” “I threw it all away to learn Wing Tsun because I had always heard the BS about a weaker opponent defeating a strong one with technique.”

So, are you saying that those 10 years of training don’t count because you didn’t find them useful? Or that it took you 10 years to figure out that you couldn’t use anything you learned?

“Wing Tsun is the only system I have experienced that can actually claim that statement. It is the ultimate martial art as far as my experience (38 years now) has shown me.”

Obviously, you are a slow learner. But you never gave up! This is what make martial arts difference from any other activity. We all start out the same way. No one is physically or mentally gifted to do martial arts. It takes time and perseveres to develop what is important and perfect to that individual.


“If you think that video is not fake I got a bridge to sell you Forest
You can't be that stupid!”

My mama always told me that life is like a box of nails, if you keep hitting them in the head, it will finally get through.

[DubChenBadanger]

Let's talk about you and your experience kid.
You speak as though you know something but have yet to say what that is, other than a cheap shot here, cheap shot there.
I figure you are still too young to know that when you say something others can't tell you are full of hot air (not qi).
Maybe someday you will grow up and quit acting like a fool.
We get alot of little kids taking cheap shots to make themselves feel like they are somebody on this loop.
You ain't foolin anybody but yourself boy.
My gym is open to everyone.
I'll teach you your first lesson for free.
DB:D

[RAB]

Lol….I don’t know if you are serious or just playing around like me.

What is interesting to me is we approach martial arts is a lot like how we approach life. I’m a Mr. No-It-All that actually knows quite a bit. I’m can be condescending and often drives people away. You’re a “bulldozer” someone that just bulldozers there way through things. You cause a lot of resentment and people don’t like you either.

Just in case you have taking anything I said personal (you did because you are like Sherman tank, I know this because I’m an expert no-it-all), I apologize for not respecting your opinion.

Now that you know a little more about me, and this is all in just fun, allow me to press a few more button.


”I'll teach you your first lesson for free.”

You have hardly said anything strategic or informative.

What I said from the beginning was to smothering and press. But you think that I know little to nothing because you don’t understand angling. The center line theory doesn’t mean stand infront and bulldoze your way through the people. But let’s say that is your style. However, you are still facing a physically stronger person. Why not clear the gate and press that person on a defense posture?

Without a doubt any strategy would have been worth trying over just putting your head down, moving the guy back and punching straight (that is what the wing chun guy did). He got hurt because he didn’t have a defense. You didn’t offer a defense either. That why I said what I did. Think about your art and how many offensive and defensive techniques there are? If there are more defensive techniques than offensive techniques then there is more for you to learn.

[DubChenBadanger]

Are you familiar with the term simultanious block (deflect) and attack? You should be if you belong to any Ving Tsun family.
My "bulldozing" methodology as you put it is quite simply the most practical approach to getting the job done. It is also Wing Tsun theory (if properly executed it works better than anything else I have experienced) not an invention of mine. What would you suggest, standing there and waiting for the attacks to come to you. This is contrary to any Wing Chun theory I know of.
A stronger opponent gives you more force to redirect. The stronger your foe the more he (or she) will hurt themselves when they attempt to attack you. Another basic Wing Tsun concept. So why would a stronger opponent be a cause of concern. As a Wing Tsun fighter I would prefer a stronger opponent as they would be easier to defeat and more of a worthwhile challenge.
Angular attacks and trapping are something Wing Tsun is famous for. In the case of what happened in the video neither would have been applicable if the would-be Wing Chun fighterd any structure to his chain punches. There was nothing trap at the start of the fight, the Karate guy was just absorbing blows. Any trained Wing Tsun fighter would have ended that fight in under 5 seconds. The Wing Chun fighter also lacked knowledge of leg techniques. He was a low level student (if that, more likely learned from a video) that had no business in the ring representing Wing Chun.
Since you don't understand the basics of Wing Tsun theory, your commentary has been vague (kind of like your martial arts experience).
Thank you for the exchange though. I am here to try and enlighten and entertain, not to push my opinions down anyones throat.
I can't take credit for any of the knowledge represented here. It is all theory handed down through our lineage.
DB

[Op108wc]

Hello there
The ideal of warrior ship is that the warrior should be sad and tender, because of that, the warrior can be very brave as well. Without that heartfelt sadness, bravery is brittle, like a china cup. If you drop it, it will break or chip. But the bravery of the warrior is like a lacquer cup, which has a wooden base covered with layers of lacquer. If the cup drops, it will bounce rather than break. Like Wing Chun Chi Sau, it is soft and hard at the same time.


El


What would you suggest, standing there and waiting for the attacks to come to you. This is contrary to any Wing Chun theory I know of.


The center line theory doesn’t mean stand infront and bulldoze your way through the people. But let’s say that is your style. However, you are still facing a physically stronger person. Why not clear the gate and press that person on a defense posture?


Wing Tsun center line theory:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3188850510944037231


Wing Chun Chi Sau

http://mastercarloslee.com/stickinghands_freefight_3.WMV

http://mastercarloslee.com/mystery_of_stickinghands_1.WMV

http://masthttp://www.mastercarloslee.com/mystery_of_stickinghands_2.WMVercarloslee.com/mystery_of_stickinghands_1.WMV

http://mastercarloslee.com/comparitive_chisau_stephen_toronto.WMV

http://mastercarloslee.com/stickinghands_class.WMV

[Cang Long]

What would you suggest, standing there and waiting for the attacks to come to you. This is contrary to any Wing Chun theory I know of. DubChenBadanger,
What about the saying you don't move I don't move, you move I move (arrive) first.

[Armin]

Hi!

About the Wing Chun vs. Karate-clip, there's only 1 thing to say: This guy was really stupig - fighting against a Kyukushin-guy with Kyukushin-rules! That was a Kyukushin-tournament. He should have known that he gets his a** wiped - these people train that kind of fighting several hours every day! :spanka:

He might have done better under different rules!

The video with Leung Ting and the BIG paper fist - I like that video very much! But it ain't about centerline - it's about how to use the turning-stance. And, somehow, it makes sense. Right?!

Well, that Carlos Lee videos. I can't help, all I see are two people rotating their arms and as soon as one of them moves or gives energy, both of them stiffen, their arms go up and nothing happens. No using energy, no bridging, no nothing. Sad.

you don't move I don't move, you move I move (arrive) first
Does that really mean one should wait until someone attacks? No!!! What may be his first move? It's clear - the preparation of an attack (e. g. the shoulder moving). That's when you move or else you'll be too late. Right?


Armin.

[Op108wc]

Royce Gracie gets beat...

Royce Gracie vs Matt Hughes UFC 60
Whereas Matt Hughes is a very well rounded fighter.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tXpdMHH6tI&search=matt%20hughes%20gracie

[DubChenBadanger]

You gotta be kidding me!
The Gracies have always been good at winning their own tournaments (their own rules). They must not have paid this guy enough. He is by no means an accomplished fighter by the way. He beat Royce, big deal! I have 3rd student levels who could beat them both at the same time.
I saw nothing but man-love going on in this video. Please do not post any more of this kind of softporn here.
If you think this kind of fighting is anything but a sick joke then I'm sure the Gracies will be happy to take your money. If you want to learn how to fight or defend yourself, I will do my best to hook you up with a qualified instructor in your area.
DB

[Armin]

Hi DB!

Remember - you can't always have the hardcore-version. And BTW: I prefer the 'Kung Fu real life'! ;) :D


Armin.

[Cang Long]

Remember - you can't always have the hardcore-version. And BTW: I prefer the 'Kung Fu real life'! Hello there Armin,
As usual you have that knack for keeping it real. How are things in Deutchland?

[Armin]

Hi Cang Long!

Thing are going well - we all seem to good more and more excited every day because of the soccer-world-championship. Everybody seems to be very happy about having 'the world' as guest in our country. Of course, there are a lot of problems, but they loose weight in face of the championship.

Well, I'm sorry for all of you, that the american team will come home so soon ... ;) :D :D :D

In the end, it will be the Brazilians against us again. But this time, playing samba won't help!!! We'll :spanka: them and win 3:1 at least. :p

Hope, everbody is well, too!


Armin.