Centerline - Self-Centerline (core)

[Emptiness]

How do you comprehand these two understandings (for the lack of nowing a better term) and How do they effect your life and your practice of HFY?

Here is how I see it in combate:

First the Centerline is the line that goes from you Self-Centerline to your opponents center of gravity. The Self -Centerline is you own center of gravity, which most remain plumb. And if your self-center line does not remain plumb it will cause distortions in the six gates. Thus causing venerability and inviting an attach. In combat the practitioner keeps his self-center line plumb and uses the centerline (rooting) to effect his opponent by positioning and ease of mobility. (Baai Jong)

In life, as I see it:

This has many meanings. There are many things in life that if aloud can effect your centerline, some good and some for bad. I think the greatest one is fear. How many times I have looked back at something I had done and thought I had made a good decision for good reasons, but when I look harder I find the root of fear at the bottom and it can be for just something very little. I think self-centeredness (Webster dictionary: concerned solely with one's own desires, needs or interests) is at the bottom of fear.

There are also many other thing, and we all now what they are!

All of these cause distortion in your life or six gates which in turn effects others and their centerlines causing variabilities and pain.

On the other side I think things such as love, giving, kindness...etc. makes are centerline stronger and plumb. I think this is where emptiness comes in; when one forgets about oneself and is more concerned about helping others his cup is empty and becomes easier to fill. And training makes the cup stronger so we are able to be gentler.

When your self-centerline is plumb and there is no distortion there is harmony with your self and the world around you.

I hope this makes sense? This is the first time I have tried to put into words :)

How does everyone else see this in there own life?

Eric

[Chango]

Hello,
It would be very difficult for me to pin point a still shot of an answer to your question. My situation is a unique one. I began learning martial arts at age 5. I then met Sifu Meng as a young teenager. He has mentored me as a person and a martial artist since. So at the point of meeting Sifu Meng and being introduced to the concept of "center" I was just forming my identity as a person. Before I met Sifu Meng as a child/ preteen in the mist of my random kicking,punching a grappling. I knew there was something I was missing. (that being principle/concept understanding) But once introduced to a view of a deeper connection of my training and life. The line between application and practice has become one with out seams or edges. In fact the line between life concepts and martial arts concept does not exist in my current state.

"Center" as I know it has many depths. I can say that it is a on going learning cycle. It can be said that this concept as with the entire system deserve a life time of examination and exploration. When I see things from my current situation Life and combat (practice) are one in the same. So now I have to answer a question with a question. Where do I begin?

I think this the begining of interesting thread. Becuase we all have different perspectives and experiences with the concept of "center"!

Chango

[duende]

I see this whole concept as rather existential in nature. This is probably why I personally was so attracted to the philosophy of HFY to begin with.

I have been taught in class, that if you don't exist, you have no time and space. It doesn't matter what religion you believe in or anything else for that matter. Prayer will do you no good, and no one can help you if you have no time and space. This appealed to me personally, as I have always found religion to be too political, or emotionally-handicapped of a construct. What do I have faith in???? I have faith that I exist.


The idea of the six gates for me is really a designation of your own time and space. Harmony is maintained until someone tries to impede your time and space. ie obstruct/penetrate your six gates. The six gates also represents the acceptance of your time and space, and the responsibilties that come with it.

Existentialism dicates that I may exist freely as long as I do not violate the existence of others. This for me is a true analogy to the state of harmony.

Maintaining your self-centerline comes into focus the more you have separated yourself from the trivialities of everyday life. The more you truly let go and accept the concept of nothingness, the closer you will be to truly knowing yourself. IE. being truly aware of your self-centerline, and the more you are in control of your own self-centerline.

KNOW YOUR SELF AND THEN YOU WILL KNOW YOUR OPPONENT

This for me is the ultimate truth about point a->b centerline.

Without truly knowing yourself, you will never know your opponent. Everything is nothing more than an illusion if you don't know yourself.

Upon knowing yourself, comes the acceptance of others. With the acceptance of others comes the disappation of fear, and the true focus on the natures. With focus on the natures comes the realization of how we are all subject to the laws of time/space/energy. Only then comes a true focus on your opponent.

Hopefully, this all won't sound like I'm preaching. I am just trying to share my understanding of the spiritual guidence and awareness that I have received from my time studying HFY with Sifu. By all means, I may be off track in some areas, but hopefully I am sharing the little I do know correctly.

[Savi]

Sisukgung Alex,
I think what you have shared here is very profound, and my understanding seems to be in accord with what you have shared.

Thank you. I'd like to share into the discussion from the lines you have presented. But I have to shift my mindset a bit back into the spiritual. I will try and come back to the discussion later.

Thanks for your input!

[Emptiness]

duende! I have read it several times now and I keep coming up with new things to think about. All though I don't agree with everything, which is all right, each fish in the pond has his own view of the same pond.

I caught this right off:

"Upon knowing yourself, comes the acceptance of others. With the acceptance of others comes the disappation of fear, and the true focus on the natures. With focus on the natures comes the realization of how we are all subject to the laws of time/space/energy. Only then comes a true focus on your opponent."

I found this in the book MKF:

By resolving to live each day as if it is the last, the Chan Buddhist warrior discovers how to experience life fully, without indecision or regret. This means developing the ability to focus the mind completely on one thought or activity, or “bounding” the mind’s learning process and thereby forgetting oneself. Most people have had the experience of concentrating so deeply on an activity that all awareness of self is eliminated. At these moments time flies, and one is able to continue engaging in mediational activity for extended periods of time without tiring. It amounts to a kind of peak experience. In Chan (Zen) this equates to being spontaneous and focused on the here and now. Moreover, when real skill is achieved in any action, one is primarily aware of what is happening at that moment, rather than of the self or the body. That which is crucial bounds the learning experience. Extraneous matters remain outside the bounds of that experiential learning session.

I think this is the acceptance that you and Chan Buddhist speak of. Accepting yourself and the present, past, and future for what they are and leaving in the moment. Sometimes we live in the past and sometimes we live in the future, but when we can live in the present and focus on nothing expt the task at hand, we truly become free. At this time we understand are selves in space, time and energy and that we are all subject to it, including are opponent(s). IMHO

The last part of it is new to me and is one reason I am so drawn to HFY. It all seems to make so much sense to me; like a door that has just been opened, which I never new existed. :)

like duende I hope no one thinks I am preaching, just trying to understand and contribut.

Eric

[duende]

Thanks Savi and Eric,

I'm interested in hearing more on your insights into the philosophical side of HFY.

Eric,

That's cool that you found a relative passage in MKF. I must say that my understanding comes from my HFY learning experience, and not the book. I have way too much ADD to absorb concepts truly from books.

I would also like to say that my understanding, or what little of it I have comes from what I would consider a Taoist perspective. I only say this because while I consider myself to know very little of either one. I do feel that I have had a much longer exposure to Taoism rather than Buddism/Chan principles in my HFY training.

One does grow into the other, and that is probably why we focus so much on Chan these days. But I will never forget my first lessons and introduction to the philosophy, that have now become my roots into the system.