Understanding Jung Sin Jong Sau

[Bryan Feagin]

I have a question about Jung Sin Jong Sau to all my Kung Fu brethren.

Ok, let's assume I understand the underlying concept,
principles, and purpose of Jong Sau: the idea of occupying, controlling, and maintaining centerline 'self-space' with forward energy. My question
is more about 'options' at the initial contact (Kiu
Sau) timeframe with the opponent (at the point Jong
Sau contact is first made). I realize that in the heat of battle, spontaneously "what comes out comes out." But I could use some clarification as to what a practitioner's 'options' are
at this specific moment in combat.

If contact is made where your Jong Sau is UNDER your
opponent's lead arm, the way I see it you basically have 3
options based on the energy your opponent is giving
you. If your opponent gives you:
1) Weak forward energy - you blast right through,
under opponent's Jong, and thrust fingers to the
eyes/face or punch/palm etc.
2) Weak outside energy - you go to Taan Sau or
perhaps an inside Laap technique
3) Strong energy crossing center - you go to Bong Sau

Now, if contact is made where your Jong Sau is OVER
your opponent's arm, what are your options based on
your opponent's energy? I see only 2 possibilities so far. The second option I'm a little fuzzy on. If your
opponent gives you:
1) Weak forward energy - you blast right through, over
the top of your opponent's Jong, and thrust fingers to
the eyes/face or punch/palm etc.
- or -
Laap/Da, Fuhk/Da or similar technique
2) Strong forward (and uplifting) energy - what to do here? Retract Jong?
Running hand? Mexican stand off?

Can anyone shed some more light on this? What other possibilities are available?

Sincerely,

Sidai Bryan F.

[duende]

if you encounter strong forward uplifting energy, then you'd better go to a High Gan Sau and redirect with your foot work taking an outside angle.

Or if your really good you could re-driect and go strait to a tok sau. But that would be sharp-shooting.

Safer to go with a High Gan Sau.

[William E]

I believe Alex is correct although I would add the following from my perspective:

The analogy of over or under the opponents arm is not the way of looking at Jung Sin Jong Say IMHO.

If you take the example of the opening move of the wooden dummy, you are deui ying (facing) your opponent prior to engagement and you would do everything possible to gain the centerline with your Jung Sin Jong Sau. Your opponents arm is over your because you've taken the centerline.

Bryan Wrote...

If contact is made where your Jong Sau is UNDER your
opponent's lead arm, the way I see it you basically have 3
options based on the energy your opponent is giving
you. If your opponent gives you:
1) Weak forward energy - you blast right through,
under opponent's Jong, and thrust fingers to the
eyes/face or punch/palm etc.
2) Weak outside energy - you go to Taan Sau or
perhaps an inside Laap technique
3) Strong energy crossing center - you go to Bong Sau


1. Don't presume that because they have no forward energy that you can blast right through. My opponent may have great structure and use that sturcture energy against my attack and possibly chum sau your advance.

When you mention that your arm ends up on top of your opponents it means that they have center. The reason is either you don't have time to react (no proper facing) before the engagement or they have a better structure than you. If you insist of moving forward with Jung Sin Jong Sau you would be crashing with your opponent. But, by using my Kui Sau (diaganonal fut sau or high gaan sau) I can keep my opponent in Kui Jong rang and positioning myself to regain a strong position. This allows me the proper space and time to perform the follow-up attack if needed.

From this point forward it's all about the Fau Kui Kui Sau.

Hope this helps.

William E.

[Bryan Feagin]

Thanks Alex and William,

As always, your insight is very much appreciated. It does seem that a high Gaan Sau w/ footwork or something similar would be the appropriate response, considering that your opponent has taken your center and compromised your structure.

Thanks again,

Sidai Feagin

[Cang Long]

Bryan,
I just reread your original post and after attending the last seminar in AZ I think I have a better understanding of what you were after. Thanks really good question.