Chum kiu

[Grande Puffo]

Hy to all,
I' m trying to solve this:
chum kiu means "searching for the bridge" or "sinking bridges" ?
Some schools advocate one or the other,
I know that there are different ideograms in chinese,
what do you think about ?
thank you in advance.

[Armin]

Hi Grande Puffo.

It depends on what style you do. In the Leung Ting system, it means "searching hands", like searching the contact to the attacker's arms. In Wong Shun Leung system, it means "sinking the bridge", like getting contact with the attacker's arms and opening them by controlling.

The sign for "Chum" is always the same, but the translation or meaning can be different. Chum Kiu can even mean, that you search for your own bridge, meaning that you try to connect or bridge lower body with upper body with arms. That means that the Chum Kiu is a bridge from Siu Nim Tao to Biu Ji.

As always there can be several different meanings.


Best wishes,

Armin.


PS: I see that you are Italian - what system are you from?

[Grande Puffo]

Hi Armin,
as i supposed there are different meanings between the lineages, but I was also searching with the ideograms in chinese that are also different.

to answer Your question :
I walked the path of wing tsun for many years, jumping between organizations...
I'm currently with Sifu Fiorentini, wich is 5°th practician grade under heading of Dai sifu Iadarola in the I.W.K.A.

and with the new connection with wengchun I suppose that most things taken for granted are not so anymore,
so I'm investigating anything ...

[Armin]

Hi Grande Puffo,

getting informed is always a good idea!

AFAIK, the symbols for "sink" and "search" are the same (or they look the same in my books). Maybe someone else can tell more?


Armin.

[JamesHFYofAZ]

The pronunciations are the same, but as far as I can tell the characters are different. Seek and search are the same nut not sink and search. Here (http://www.mandarintools.com/chardict.html) is a good and understandable link to help. I have others but they are more for learning how to structure words together so I can get confusing.:D

[Grande Puffo]

Originally posted by JamesHFYofAZ
Here (http://www.mandarintools.com/chardict.html) is a good and understandable link to help.

interesting link JamesHFYofAZ, thank you.

[JamesHFYofAZ]

Your welcome, did you get the answers you were looking for? If not, I could give you links to more confusing search sites!:D

[Grande Puffo]

Originally posted by JamesHFYofAZ
Your welcome, did you get the answers you were looking for? If not, I could give you links to more confusing search sites!:D

If You feel good at it, come on.
:D :D

By the way I'm thinking on a new level of thought now, and in a couple of day I'll share to You what I approached.
Thanks

[Phil Redmond]

Hi, I speak Cantonese and there are 7 tones. One word can be pronounced in 7 different "musical" tones and have completely different meanings. The Chaam for search and the Chahm for sink have distinct characters and sound different. You have to be careful when you say a Cantonese word. You might use the wrong tone and insult someone. For example, the verb, "to be" is haih , but hai can be an inappropriate word as well.
PR

[Grande Puffo]

So, I'm here again.
After a lot of thought, I'm apt to believe that no one( (as lineage) is totally wrong and maybe the original meaning for "sink" and "search" are lost ...

:)

I think of :searching &/o seeking as:
searching of your OWN bridge.
in this case i would immagine doing the Chum kiu in a way to stimulate your own rooting.
By creating line of force, so search where to obtain it.
Example found in the tan/pak set after the turning,
and from double(crossed) tan to bong sao/ wu sao.
the body uses his own overload to stimulate reactions.

Having in mind the principle "when the line is free, attack" it make no sense " when the line is free, go to search a bridge", as seems to understand from the usual meaning of the form...
Maybe should have been more correct create a "obtain a brige"as an eventuality and not an intention.


and
sinking as:
destroying the opponent' bridge by walking on it.having found your own structure, stable and rooted i/e powerful, connecting to that line between you and your opponent in a way to take advantage in the form of pivot point .

in any way for me is not limited as only the "hands" as bridge,
but from the feet on up through knee ,hip, shoulder.

I don't know if I explained myself in a good way but hope you'll understand.
:-)
Bye



:) :) :) :)